Nitro
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Posts posted by Nitro
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It's not the defense that causes that...it's the pace.
League averages this season: 105.4 Ortg (points per 100 possessions), 91.8 pace (possessions per 48min), 49.2% EFG
League averages in '84-'85 (Jordan's 1st season and the primes of guys like Magic, Bird, Nique etc..): 107.9 Ortg, 102.1 Pace (!!!), 49.6% EFG
As you can see, the difference in offensive effectiveness really isn't much different, it's just that in the '80's there were a lot more possessions to eclipse 70pts than today's era.
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Lol, that's insane. [expletive]as really need their fried chicken huh!
Don't laugh...[expletive]as and their fried chicken is NEVER a laughing matter.
I expect more from you, bro.
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When you started watching the Lakers you had banner after banner hanging in the rafters, fielding solid teams and having all that history to remember.
When I had Nets season tickets in '97 you know what I got? Keith Van [expletive]ing Horn, and the stupid pre-game video on the jumbotron of him flying a [expletive]ing spaceship with Kerry Kittles (or Kedall Gill, I forget). Oh, we did have this up and comer with a lot of promise named Jayson Williams. He fulfilled that potential by shooting his limo driver with a shotgun.
I hope to god the Lakers suck for a few years to bring you fans down to Earth a bit...not necessarily you or anyone here, just in general. Greediest, most entitled fanbase in all of sports besides the Yankees.
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Fortunately for myself, I started watching the Lakers in the post-Magic era with Del Harris. And watched them during the post-Shaq era.
Stop. Since Magic left you guys have NEVER won less than 33 games. Had a losing record only 3x. Within 5 years after breaking up Showtime you guys were back winning 50+ games with a young Shaq/Kobe duo. Since Magic left you guys have won 50 games 14x (counting the lockout seasons based on winning %). You won 60+ games 3x. 5 championships. 7 Finals appearances. Saw two top 10 players in their primes.
Meanwhile, here in NJ...
http://pauloccamacho.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/netsfansbags.jpg
YOU DON'T KNOW PAIN LAKERS FANS!!!!
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The funny thing about our lack of depth is, there's really no use in giving it as a reason for our struggles because, quite frankly, our starters can't even build a lead to allow our bench to come in and do anything (and I'm sure they wouldn't to begin with, we have nothing in our second unit, aside from Earl Clark...who was just moved up to starter).
See, I look at it a bit differently...having a deep bench allows you to adjust if the starting lineup is sucking like it has been. They have NOTHING to replace Nash, Kobe and Metta with if those guys are being exposed by their matchup (Nash's poor defense, a cold shooting night by Kobe, Metta being...Metta, etc...). They have 0 explosive scoring threats off the bench. They've never had any reasonable replacement for Pau during all his struggles (Clark is nice, but he's not starter material yet, and he's undersized). No defensive stoppers off the bench. No one that can change the tempo of the game in contrast to the starters.
I do agree they should still be above .500, but I still view it as a HUGE reason for their historical sucking.
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Not sure if Wade will get back to a respectable level on the defensive end for an entire playoff run. I mean, we can point out games, but I just don't see it in him out there...and sometimes, I don't see that "coasting" look on his face. I see him pushing hard on defense every now and then, and he still doesn't perform well enough.
He has improved slightly since the beginning of the season, where I thought Miami was dreadful on defense (hell, they were probably bottom five in the league for 4-5 weeks), but to say he can defend at an elite level for 15-20+ games in late April, May and early June, all against playoff teams and repeat games in a series? I don't know.
I don't see why he wouldn't be able to. His main assignments come playoff time will be Kidd/JR, Rip Hamilton, Avery Bradley, Joe Johnson and probably Paul George. Solid group of players, but it's not like he's defending any top 10 players in that list. And honestly the only one I see giving him a lot of trouble is JR, whose game is almost completely dependant on a terrible shot selection that can't be defended by anyone once he catches fire.
The offense will be a bigger struggle. He's still got the timing, lateral quickness and crazy long arms to make a huge impact on a consisten basis defensively IF HE WANTS TO. Offensively, there are some defenses that he simply doesn't have the physical tools to dominate anymore.
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To sum up my feelings on why the Lakers have sucked this year, in order of importance...
1A) Coaching.
1B) Depth.
2) Being below average athletically at 4 of the 5 starting positions, and also basically the entire bench.
3) Injuries.
4) Gasol.
Bottom line is their 2 "permanent" coaches are retards, they lack talent outside of the top 4 and that 4th guy has played miserably, and since training camp they've been hit pretty hard with injuries to their most important players. Add it all up and you get this shit show.
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Also I'm one of the believers that says Wade isn't turning it on yet. I think the last month going into the playoffs your gonna see the monster wade when 100% healthy and fresh. LeBron and Wade gonna go ape on everyone they face come playoff time.
Wade ain't turning it on 'till later in the season...agreed. Offensively I think he's lost enough athletcism to where he's not capable of what he was doing a few years ago, but defensively he's coasted much of this season. Come playoff time all those open 3 pointers he's been giving up won't be there for the opposition, and as he showed by shutting down Kobe, his on-ball defense is still elite when locked in. He has picked his spots offensively much better the last 2 months after that terrible November, and as long as he does that he'll remain extremely dangerous offensively.
Miami's defense goes as LeBron and Wade go...they are the anchors, and have been since they came together. Neither has really turned it on yet this season and that, along with an increase of small-ball has made them an average team on that side of the ball. Once they turn it on, this defense goes back to being very good. If Birdman works out, or if Spo chills on the small-ball thing, they become great again.
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LeBron James and Dwyane Wade, shown at a shootaround before an NBA Finals game in 2012, have been competing with each other this season over shooting percentages.
By Ethan J. Skolnick
Palm Beach Post Staff Writer
MIAMI —
His feet soaking in ice after a late December victory against Charlotte, LeBron James received a cold, unpleasant splash of water to the face. It came from the stat sheet that he had dropped in the bucket.
“Damn!”
James had just recorded 27 points, 12 rebounds, eight assists and four steals in a victory against the Bobcats, and yet one number struck him as entirely unacceptable.
“Nine for 19!”
Yes, nine for 19 – as in a shade under 50 percent.
So why would this matter?
“It’s like a competition me and D-Wade are having right now about who can shoot 50 percent, in each and every game,” James said, when asked a couple of days later. “I had no idea, because I don’t know what’s going on throughout the game as far as stats. I came in after the game, I saw 9-for-19 and I missed that last long three, I felt I could have gotten into the lane and got a layup. I’ve got to make up for it.”
Well, he has since.
James has shot 50 percent or better in 11 of the past 12 games, the only exception in Portland on Jan. 10. Since that stumble, he has shot 64.9 percent over the past four games. That has lifted his overall field goal accuracy to 55 percent for the season which, if it holds, which would mark the sixth straight season that he’s set a career high. He has shot at least 50 percent in 31 of his 38 games this season, and his effective field goal percentage (which accounts for the difficulty and benefit of 3-point shots) is a career-high 58.6, better than Michael Jordan’s in any season.
And no, not everything is a dunk. According to basketballreference.com, James has shot 77.6 percent at the rim, but only 35 of his shots have come from there.
All of this is much more impressive than the 20-point streak that was recently stopped at 54. James can put up points simply from sheer volume of attempts, with the ball in his hands so much. To post these percentages, you need to show patience, restraint and discretion.
“Early in my career, I didn’t take every shot as seriously as I do now, to be more efficient,” James said. “It comes with age, it comes with experience. You know, when you’re an 18 year old rookie, or a 21-year-old, third year in the league, you can get away with a lot of mistakes, and not looking at numbers as much. But as I’ve gotten older, I’ve been more efficient, taking care of the ball. I value possessions more.”
He also values competition, and he’s been in one with Wade. Wade is also shooting the highest percentage of his career, at 50.6, a fact that Erik Spoelstra noted Thursday while asserting that if Wade was shooting as much as he once did, he could still average 28 points.
“We’re both so conscious of wanting to shoot 50 percent, that sometimes you wish you had that Kobe (Bryant) thought, where you just don’t care,” Wade said. “We talk about it all the time. It sucks at times, but it’s who we are.”
And yes, Wade also checks the stat sheets after every game. He was irritated with himself after shooting 9-for-20 in Orlando on New Year’s Eve. Wade has a ways to go to catch James in the competition; he’s been 50 percent or better in 19 of his 34 games. For his career, Wade is now just a tick (48.6 to 48.7) behind James.
“I’ve been challenged like this since I came in the league,” Wade said. “(Heat assistant Bob) McAdoo challenged me early on to try to shoot 50 percent. So he kind of messed me up early on.”
McAdoo, a Hall of Famer, shot 50.3 percent for his career.
“But when LeBron came here, he probably cared about it more, because that’s what we talk about,” Wade said.
Yes, and think about, even during games. You ever notice James holding the ball in the backcourt, waiting for the buzzer to sound, before launching a longshot 60-footer, like he did in Golden State?
Or Wade doing the same?
You assume that’s an accident.
“We were in Dallas,” Wade said, laughing as he recalled a Jan. 2 game in which he shot 9-for-21 and had the ball in his hands, far from the basket, with the clock winding down. “I was like, ‘Why did I just shoot that?’ But I had four seconds. I was like, ‘Damn.’ You have no choice when you have that much time. It would have looked bad.”
So why isn’t there a third party to this competition?
After all, Chris Bosh is shooting 54.5 percent, highest of his career, and bringing his career percentage to 49.5.
“It wouldn’t be fair,” Bosh said, smiling. “I expect to shoot 50 percent all the time.”
Wade agreed.
“Yeah, it wouldn’t be fair,” Wade said, pausing. “It just wouldn’t be. I’m not going to say why. He can’t play with us. His shots come a little differently.”
All’s good for everyone so long as at least half go through.
Love it.
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[expletive] Boston... so the Lakers
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I pray for you.
Get the hell outta there while you still can lol
Walgreens is like the mafia...once you get in deep, you can't get out.
IC3.
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Again, that is just scoring points per 100. It's not utilizing ANYONE'S strengths to the fullest, and that's why it sucks.
We are 25th in turnovers. We are 15th in 3PT shooting, 14th in assists, usually 10th or worse in FG% (rarely see us above that), 29th in free throw makes.
If it wasn't for us scoring so many points, at a high pace (2nd in the NBA in pace), our offense wouldn't be 8th in the NBA right now (in Offensive Rating, by the way).
There's more to it than just an offensive rating. Chris Duhon has the second-highest offensive rating on our team, next to Steve Nash. Jordan Hill is fourth, Earl Clark is 5th. That's laughable. I don't really give a shit what an offensive rating says...our offense is not that great.
1) You guys are 4th in FT makes, 1st in FTA. 29th in FT%, but that amount of free throws is still a positive.
2) Because of being a pretty good 3pt shooting team, and taking that volume, the offense is more efficient at producing points than at first glance of raw stats.
3) Lakers are 8th in offensive rebounding, which counter-balances the awful turnover numbers.
4) Pace is number of possessions, which is what Ortg accounts for. Pace would be a good arguement against the Lakers' good Ortg if they were doing a ton of damage in transition, but they are bottom 5 in turnovers forced.
I stated that the offense needed to run through Dwight more so Kobe wouldn't have to play 40 minutes a night and score 30+ a game. We will play through Kobe regardless, but Dwight has to be involved FAR more.Agreed. Although, his high turnovers, career-low FT% and limited repetoire in the post makes it a bit hard at times to make him the focal point in the offense. When he was with Orlando he didn't get a ton more opportunities, and he was more of a decoy for their 3pt shooting gameplan as opposed to the other way around. Lakers would be able to utilize that gameplan more if Gasol didn't clog the paint, and/or suck on the perimeter.
When did I say this? I stated that Kobe is having to play far too many minutes, and score too many points. I have no idea where you assumed I said he was turning into Steve Novak in that post.You make it seem through your posts the last few days that the offense is running completely around Nash, and in your first post you said that the offense needs to run through Kobe and Dwight, hinting that it hasn't run through Kobe all along.
If I assumed wrong, sorry.
We're the Lakers, not the Nuggets. We don't play for early playoff exits. You aren't dangerous if you're losing in the second round.Well, with this current roster and coaching, you are currently playing for a high lottery pick that I'm sure you guys don't even have the rights to. Improve the defense and you guys are at least a playoff team. Add a few small, low-risk/high-reward pieces (like Miami did with Birdman) to improve the bench and give the team a little more balance, and suddenly you guys can become dangerous. A major trade would be needed to be a true contender.
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He wouldn't need to score 30 a night, 40 minutes a night, if we actually had an offense that played through him AND Dwight Howard. Double-post motion, or the four-out, one in...whatever it could be, it needs to be something that uses our second superstar AND Nash's shooting abilities, so Kobe isn't dragging his feet.
You guys can praise the offense all you want, but it's no good.
Howard isn't getting touches
Ron Artest is our second scoring option
Nash isn't shooting the ball
Gasol is not in the post
Kobe is forced to average 30
The offense sucks, don't care how many points per 100 possessions we score.
The offense doesn't suck...it's not utilizing the team's strengths to the fullest, but top 5-6 in the league (last time I checked a few days ago) is far from awful.
And they don't need to utilize Kobe any more offensively...no matter the coach, system or Nash's presence, he's been doing way too much this season. Sometimes it's necessary for him to take 20+ shots, but his usage has been far too high this season (just like the previous 2 seasons where he led the league in USG%.). I'd much rather see his minutes and shot attempts get cut and him continue to put in a stronger effort defensively. Him taking 20+ shot attempts just ain't working anymore, and his efficiency has fallen off the cliff.
He's still getting plenty of iso's and PnR opportunities...you act like Nash has made him into Steve Novak.
Top 10 offense, bottom 10 defense. FIx the latter, and you got a dangerous playoff team. Not enough to beat the top 3 out West, but far better than 17-24.
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Kobe wouldn't be dead tired in the third quarter
Kobe being dead tired has nothing to do with running the offense through Nash...it has to do with the 39MPG on 34 year-old legs (one who has 17 years and countless deep post-season runs, and a few Olympic appearances on his resume), while taking over 22 FGA's per game and recently taking tougher defensive assignments.
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Absolutely not. He's still a top 10 player in the league, probably top 5 when healthy, and he's one of the only impactful 2-way bigs in the league. As a FA he will make the most money if he stays in LA, and LA will still probably be the most attractive destination for him (compared to a place like Atlanta, or Dallas). Take your chances and hold onto him, as he is one of the few, true franchise players that can lead your team to a title the next 4-5 seasons.
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http://edgewoodproperties.com/images/properties/rt36/rt36_pic_big.png
Hell.
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That's all on paper, dude. Ron Artest is taking more FGA/G than Howard, Nash, and Gasol. Kobe is still averaging 30 PPG. We are shooting more threes than 27 other teams in the NBA, but are at a league average in percentage. We are turning the ball over far, far too much. We can't make free throws.
How is offense not a problem of ours?
Defense is the biggest problem we have, but our offense is dragging our guys down, having to chase down players on the break off of turnovers and long boards, and just having to play in a system that doesn't work with who we have (and I'll continue to stick by this as long as we're losing, because Howard is not being featured out there).
Did you watch the Miami game? 16 turnovers in the first half, leading to around 20 Miami points. Given they shot around 2-19 from outside the paint in the first half of that game, and basically made everything inside, you'd think the entire course of that game would have been changed if we didn't turn the ball over in that first half as many times as we do an entire game.
Our decisions on the offensive end most certainly alter how we play (or are forced to play) defense. That has been a part of basketball for years.
First off, I said offense wasn't "the" problem...they are 6th in Ortg so far this season, and that's without Nash for most of the season, as well as spot games without Howard.
Secondly, yes, there are aspects of their offense that is of concern. Metta taking 11+ shots isn't ideal, although this season he has actually been average when it comes to efficiency. The turnovers are ridiculous, you're right. And the FT shooting, due to Howard, is also a concern. HOWEVER...they are 9th in FG%, 11% in 3pt%, #1 in FTA, and top 10 in offensive rebounding. They have a 30PPG scorer averaging career high in efficiency, Dwight is still giving 18PPG on near 60% shooting, and Nash, while not shooting as much as either of us would like, is his usual efficient self.
Bottom line is despite the injuries and surrounding the Big 4 with scrubs, they are still, statistically, the 6th best offense in the league. On that end of the floor, they have the talent to keep getting better, and if they make a few small moves to upgrade the bench, they will be in contention for most productive offense in the league.
Defensively is where the real issue is, because Pau continues to break down and certainly can't play PF anymore, Nash is at a massive physical disadvantage with this era of freakishly athletic PG's, Kobe gets lazy with his off-ball defense and has trouble on-ball when he has to go through screens, Metta doesn't have the lateral quickness to defend a lot of elite perimeter scorers, and the rest of the team besides Earl Clark is pretty much incapable of playing defense. To make matters far worse, they got one of the worst defensive coaches in the league that doesn't know how to cover his personel's weaknesses with schemes to maximize Howard's impact. In order to get anywhere near "good", or even "passable" on this side of the ball, they need to make serious changes...either a new coach and a few small additions, or some major trades that will completely change the roster outside of the Nash/Kobe/Dwight trio.
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The season he is having now is historic. This year he is in the 50/40/90 club averaging 29PPG, and a ridiculous TS% of over 65% due to how frequently he gets to the line. Those numbers are pretty much unheard of.
It's tough to gauge exactly where he ranks all-time, though. He is a high volume scorer who is NOT streaky...you don't get a ton of 45-50pt+ scoring outbursts that you get with guys like Jordan, Kobe, T-Mac, AI, etc... However, you don't get many of the 8-24 nights that those guys had frequently, as well (except prime MJ). I think Real Deal is really underrating what he can do as a scorer. Sure, he don't got much of a post-game, but what seperates him from so many of the league's greatest scorers is that he's absolutely deadly off-ball. He is an unbelievable catch-and-shoot 3pt shooters who is elite in spot-ups, off curls, and those "stop on a dime" transition 3's. Due to his size and length, it is damn-near impossible to even alter his shot once he rises up. Like, he is so tall and has such a good vertical jump that it is hard to even get a hand in his face, let alone threaten him with blocking his shot. He has also gotten better and more careful with his handle, so he has more ways of beating you in iso situations, and he has the first step and size to be extremely effective at getting to the rim and finishing. He also is very good at initiating contact and getting to the line, both on drives and shot attempts.
In other words, this guy is insanely unique...I've never seen anything like him in terms of size + repetoire + mindset. I tend to value that killer instinct of a scorer to go for 50+ on any given night, which he doesn't have like MJ and Kobe did/does. However, his insane efficiency at a 30PPG volume is really tough to beat.
So, as far as scorers go, I'm very tempted to already put him top 5 all-time. I'd take him over the likes of AI, T-Mac, Dirk, Wade, Drexler, King, Melo, Wilkins, Bird, Barkley, Malone, Hakeem, etc... I'd comfortably put MJ over him, at this point would probably still trust prime Kobe over him (although it's very, very close), and Dantley had insane volume/efficiency but I haven't seen much film of him so let's slide him in there as well. I'd probably take prime Shaq over him, and if LeBron continues this hyper-efficient outside shooting it's a tossup there.
So, my top 6 is MJ, Kobe, Dantley, Shaq, LeBron and Durant. Don't really know where Dantley stands, so he may or may not be top 5 all-time.
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As someone else said, offense isn't the problem. Kobe's one of the 2-3 best scorers in the league, Nash is one of the best shooters and passers, and Dwight's the best finisher. Most offensive holes they have are because of the supporting cast...that can be patched up mostly with small trades, FA signings (waivers, guys like Delonte West and Kenyon Martin, etc..) and continuing to try and work Pau in different lineups to maximize what he can give you.
The team needs help defensively, and until they get better there they won't make the playoffs.
As far as major trades go, the Lakers just don't have the pieces. Pretty much no attractive young talent, no draft picks, Pau and Metta are undesirable trade-bait with bad contracts, etc... However, their top talent is good enough to get them by, and there is enough value out their to make a few moves to get a lot stronger after the top 4. And when that happens, their stars will play better, and the team will finally come together. Probably a little too late, though.
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LeBron is in the top 15 all-time right now (which is unreal for a 28 year old with only 1 ring), and will probably end up top 6 by the time his career is over, with a chance at being 2nd or 3rd. Jordan still beats him in about every statistical category with far more accolades.
Oh, and I'm lazy and don't wanna find the article, but as of last week he's the #1 spot-up 3pt shooter in the entire league this season.
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http://i.imgur.com/vRxJ2.jpg
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This is probably the most bizzare sports story I have ever heard.
What...the...[expletive].
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He mad.
Killa .gif FTW.
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Cool, it wasn't a Spurs home game. There's no need to be suing them or the Heat.
Try again.
It's worse that it wasn't a Spurs home game. Spurs fans in Miami only get 1 chance a year to see them, and they didn't get to see their 3 best players, as well as one of their top role players. Not because they were unable to play. And the rest thing really should only apply to Duncan and maybe Ginobili, but definitely not Parker and Green. It was a statement by Pop, and while I think Stern shouldn't be fining Pop over 200k for it, I would be furious as a fan. If nothing else, those fans should get some kind of refund...they wouldn't have had to premium for a game against a bottom-feeder like Washington or Toronto, so why should they have to pay top price for Spurs team that rolled out a lineup with that kind of talent?
Scoring today vs. in the 80's
in General NBA Discussion
Posted · Edited by Nitro
The actual scoring efficiency and productiveness per 100 possessions is basically the same now as it was then. You can argue that offenses now are also better than they were then, but the dominance of offenses over defenses back in the '80's were basically the same as they are today.
1) Not one team in '84-'85 averaged a pace lower than 98. So no, I don't feel they could score 120PPG, or even 110PPG with their current roster and pace.2) Looking at raw FG% is faulty. EFG ajdusts for 3 pointers, which teams barely took back from '70-'90. Besides shots at the rim, they are the most efficient shot attempt in basketball, even though it brings down basically every team's raw FG%.
Defenses are better now than they were from '70-'90, however the main culprit for the stats you posted are from pace.