Broussard: MJ's ex-teammates say Kobe is better than him

[The Regime]

Earlier today on his ESPN Radio show, Colin Cowherd was having the requisite “Where does Kobe Bryant fit in among the greatest NBA players” discussion. By coincidence, ESPN NBA writer Chris Broussard happened to be strolling by the studio, and Cowherd asked him to give his two cents.

 

Broussard said that he has a top 10 list of all-time NBA players. The list, in no particular order, looks like this: Shaquille O’Neal, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Wilt Chamberlain, Bill Russell, Hakeem Olajuwon, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird, Oscar Robertson, Michael Jordan, and Kobe Bryant.

 

But in the midst of this discussion, Broussard dropped an interesting tidbit: apparently, unidentified ex-teammates of Michael Jordan have told him that “Kobe is better.”

 

http://www.sportsgrid.com/nba/michael-jordans-former-teammates-thinks-kobe-bryant-is-better/

Edited March 15, 2011 by Confidence

[EastCoastNiner]

They are absolutely correct, and it's funny to see how many of you are finally starting to come back to reality and realize that after a few years of saying I was crazy.

 

In ECN, we trust!

[reno]

Only people I find who think kobe is better is either die hard kobe homers, or someone who has a nat against mj, like ecn. And I live in Laker land, also ,"mystery players"? Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah great journalism

[YugoRocketsFan]

Michael Jordan is better than Kobe by a mile, who cares what Jordan's ex-teammates, best friends, enemies, ex-wives, etc. have to say when Jordan is easily better than him?

[Clutch]

for every 1 player that thinks kobe is better there are 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 more who thinks the opposite

[Check my Stats]

"mystery players"? Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah great journalism

 

/thread.

[Real Deal]

Wilt is the GOAT because of his numbers. Game over!

 

...

 

If people really can't consider the fact that Kobe has more offensive skills than Jordan, and that it's pretty damn close when talking about the overall player, I feel sorry for you.

 

Jordan is the greatest due to the combination of his talent + achievements, but Kobe is arguably the best player to touch a ball. More range than MJ, more offensive skills, Jordan the more tenacious defensive player, and it all fits together like a puzzle. Today, I'll tell you Kobe. Tomorrow, I'll give you Jordan. It's that close. I'm not the super Kobe homer to bash Jordan, and I'm not a major Jordan homer to deny Kobe's talent (and, typically, you're one or the other...or you hate one or the other).

[Real Deal]

By the way, I believe one of those teammates is Scottie. He is on record saying that Jordan is greater than Bryant due to his team accomplishments.

 

“To say who’s the greatest player of all time – you may have to give that to Michael right now because of what he was able to accomplish in the game as an individual, from a team standpoint,” revealed Pippen. “He was at the top in every aspect of the game – offensively as well as defensively. Has Kobe met that yet? No. Will he? Maybe not. But does that make him less of a player than Michael was? No it does not.

And, Pippen has defended BOTH during his career, Jordan in practices all the time (according to him and MJ, and even Phil) and Kobe back in the LA/Portland days (Scottie was an excellent defender in Portland), and that wasn't even Kobe's best days.

 

However, it's not a stretch to think that Pippen would remain anonymous about that. He has no reason to dive into a war of words with his teammate, the guy who basically won him six championships. They are seen as one of the greatest duos of all-time, and would probably like to stay away from a Kobe/Shaq situation, especially since both are retired and recognized for what they did together.

[YugoRocketsFan]

Wilt is the GOAT because of his numbers. Game over!

 

...

 

If people really can't consider the fact that Kobe has more offensive skills than Jordan, and that it's pretty damn close when talking about the overall player, I feel sorry for you.

 

Jordan is the greatest due to the combination of his talent + achievements, but Kobe is arguably the best player to touch a ball. More range than MJ, more offensive skills, Jordan the more tenacious defensive player, and it all fits together like a puzzle. Today, I'll tell you Kobe. Tomorrow, I'll give you Jordan. It's that close. I'm not the super Kobe homer to bash Jordan, and I'm not a major Jordan homer to deny Kobe's talent (and, typically, you're one or the other...or you hate one or the other).

 

I still put Jordan above him because he was "THE MAN" for his entire career and has 6 finals MVPs.

[Real Deal]

I still put Jordan above him because he was "THE MAN" for his entire career and has 6 finals MVPs.

That's exactly what I said...the achievements.

 

Nash won two MVP awards. I wonder how many people think he's greater than Karl Malone (or as great).

 

Chauncey Billups and Tony Parker both have Finals MVP awards. Kevin Garnett didn't get one in 2008. Billups and Parker are nowhere near Garnett.

 

Had Bryant not ran the offense AND took the most shots in five of six championship seasons (took more than Shaq in two of three), I'd agree that he wasn't the man...but he did a lot of heavy lifting, as well as defending the best player on the opposing team and being the clutch player when Shaq was sitting the bench late in games (teams wanting to foul him, so Phil would put him on the bench).

 

Two Batmans in Los Angeles, from the second championship up until 2004. The only time Kobe could be considered a Robin was the first championship.

[AboveLegit]

You can't just immediately throw out the credibility of MJ's teammates (the one's saying Kobe's the better player).

 

But, I just read yesterday that Phil Jackson said MJ is far and away the better player.

[The Truth]

Today, I'll tell you Kobe. Tomorrow, I'll give you Jordan. It's that close.

so basically, you have no idea lol.

[YugoRocketsFan]

That's exactly what I said...the achievements.

 

Nash won two MVP awards. I wonder how many people think he's greater than Karl Malone (or as great).

 

Chauncey Billups and Tony Parker both have Finals MVP awards. Kevin Garnett didn't get one in 2008. Billups and Parker are nowhere near Garnett.

 

Had Bryant not ran the offense AND took the most shots in five of six championship seasons (took more than Shaq in two of three), I'd agree that he wasn't the man...but he did a lot of heavy lifting, as well as defending the best player on the opposing team and being the clutch player when Shaq was sitting the bench late in games (teams wanting to foul him, so Phil would put him on the bench).

 

Two Batmans in Los Angeles, from the second championship up until 2004. The only time Kobe could be considered a Robin was the first championship.

 

You do have a point but Jordan didn't have someone of Shaq's caliber on his team. Finals MVPs are a bit different than MVPs in general because the point of MVPs is to really state who the most valuable person is to the best team, finals MVPs are given to player who are outstanding in the finals (biggest stage of the game). I am not here to debate, just present my stance on the whole issue.

[reno]

By the way, I believe one of those teammates is Scottie. He is on record saying that Jordan is greater than Bryant due to his team accomplishments.

 

 

And, Pippen has defended BOTH during his career, Jordan in practices all the time (according to him and MJ, and even Phil) and Kobe back in the LA/Portland days (Scottie was an excellent defender in Portland), and that wasn't even Kobe's best days.

 

However, it's not a stretch to think that Pippen would remain anonymous about that. He has no reason to dive into a war of words with his teammate, the guy who basically won him six championships. They are seen as one of the greatest duos of all-time, and would probably like to stay away from a Kobe/Shaq situation, especially since both are retired and recognized for what they did together.

“To say who’s the greatest player of all time – you may have to give that to Michael right now because of what he was able to accomplish in the game as an individual, from a team standpoint,” revealed Pippen. “He was at the top in every aspect of the game – offensively as well as defensively. Has Kobe met that yet? No. Will he? Maybe not. But does that make him less of a player than Michael was? No it does not."

 

 

Pippen also goes on record saying mj would average 40-45 ppg and score 100. I believe you're wrong.

 

Also a bit of a stretch if you're implying pippen is saying mj is only better than kobe because of his awards at this point. And who, as an athlete, would say too anyone you're less of a player? No one. Thats just an ass thing to say.

 

Also, if kobe is much more skillful than mj on the offense side of the ball, such as ball handling, why does he have more turnovers? Wilts era, from player athlete standpoint, is far far far different than late 80s/90s compared to the 00's. Please.

 

And I thought quotes from past players didn't matter?

Edited March 15, 2011 by dabearfan101

[Real Deal]

so basically, you have no idea lol.

That's obviously not what that meant. It means that both are right there.

 

I grew up watching Jordan as my favorite player, and aside from Kobe, I saw Jordan play more than anyone else.

 

And, unlike most, it was live...not Youtube clips and DVDs. I saw Jordan when he was incredible, saw the games he sucked in, saw him dominate Detroit and get owned by Payton, saw him win his first championship live on my TV.

 

I'm pretty sure I would have an idea.

[The Truth]

That's obviously not what that meant. It means that both are right there.

 

I grew up watching Jordan as my favorite player, and aside from Kobe, I saw Jordan play more than anyone else.

 

And, unlike most, it was live...not Youtube clips and DVDs. I saw Jordan when he was incredible, saw the games he sucked in, saw him dominate Detroit and get owned by Payton, saw him win his first championship live on my TV.

 

I'm pretty sure I would have an idea.

lol I was jk bro.

[Real Deal]

Pippen also goes on record saying mj would average 40-45 ppg and score 100. I believe you're wrong.

Pippen didn't specifically say how. Under Phil, Jordan wouldn't...doesn't matter what anyone says or thinks. The triangle offense wouldn't present that opportunity. Kobe still played within the triangle when he averaged his 35 a game, ditched it a few times, but if the coach was someone like Flip Saunders, Bryant could've easily reached the 37 PPG plateau that Jordan touched, and more. Not a single player had an answer for Kobe in his ultimate prime, and if Phil didn't hound him about getting Odom involved (which eventually led to the Game 7 meltdown against the Suns), Bryant could've done whatever he wanted.

 

Also, if kobe is much more skillful than mj on the offense side of the ball, such as ball handling, why does he have more turnovers? Wilts era, from player athlete standpoint, is far far far different than late 80s/90s compared to the 00's. Please.

Bryant has more turnovers because he had the ball more. Pippen actually facilitated half the time. The Odom experiment was a huge, huge failure, and everyone who watched the Lakers in 2005 realized it, and Phil didn't take too long to figure that out, either (less than a full season).

 

Plus, turnovers are a two-way street. Kwame Brown was losing passes 2-3 times a game, off his hands or not even recognizing the ball was going in to him. Same with Odom, who we would call "Odumb" because of his mental lapses.

 

Kobe's highest TO season was 2004-05, ironically.

 

And I thought quotes from past players didn't matter?

There's substance in them if the player has played against those he's talking about. If this player is Pippen, I'll invest in it a bit. If it's Magic, someone who has never had the opportunity to defend Bryant, it's different. Ron Artest? Not even him, because he never held a prime Jordan.

 

You can say what you want, but there's no denying that Kobe has faced more doubles than any player not named Shaq. His percentages have gone down, and he has averaged more turnovers (partially due to that, the other being his teammates). Jordan had Scottie and shooters that were netting 47% or better from the floor, drilling open shots, some of the best three-point specialists in the league as well. Teams lost to Chicago because they had no idea how to defend ANYONE on that team...couldn't double Jordan because they'd leave a shooter open (illegal zone otherwise), and couldn't play anyone face-up because Jordan would go nuts.

 

You have a lot to learn about the game, dude...a lot that those Youtube clips won't explain to you. Mike is an incredible player, and the GOAT, but Kobe is tailing him, and overall, one could make the argument that he's a better overall player. I think you're a bit obsessed with the idea that has been spoon-fed that Jordan was invincible, but I've seen Michael at his best and worst. He was more selfish than Bryant, taking 24+ shots per game 4-5 times in his career (Kobe just once), going through spurts where he would completely disregard his teammates (just as Kobe has done), and having pretty bad games both early and late in his career.

 

Did you see how many turnovers he averaged before he won his first ring? In all five seasons before that (I don't consider his sophomore season because he played 18 games), Jordan averaged over 3.0 TO a night, which is 0.1 under Kobe's average.

 

I'm sorry.

[reno]

Phil Jackson says Kobe Bryant not in Michael Jordan's company

 

Kobe has patterned himself after Michael, and there are a lot of identical things there,” Jackson told the Los Angeles Times, “but it's one thing to hope to be like him, it's another thing to be like him."

Kobe Bryant earns high praise from Phil Jackson, but the Lakers coach says his current star should not be compared to Michael Jordan. (AP photo)

 

"I'm with (ESPN's) Bill Simmons on this," he added. "We have to take Michael Jordan out of the equation. Stop comparing anyone to Michael Jordan. It's just not fair. He was remarkable. ...

 

"(Kobe) doesn't shoot the same percentage (.455) as Michael (.497). He has the same characteristics as Michael, but he's not the same player. It takes nothing away from him — he's a great player in his own right."

 

http://aol.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2011-03-14/phil-jackson-says-kobe-bryant-not-in-michael-jordans-company#ixzz1Gjau8FZu

[Real Deal]

Phil Jackson says Kobe Bryant not in Michael Jordan's company

 

Kobe has patterned himself after Michael, and there are a lot of identical things there,” Jackson told the Los Angeles Times, “but it's one thing to hope to be like him, it's another thing to be like him."

Kobe Bryant earns high praise from Phil Jackson, but the Lakers coach says his current star should not be compared to Michael Jordan. (AP photo)

 

"I'm with (ESPN's) Bill Simmons on this," he added. "We have to take Michael Jordan out of the equation. Stop comparing anyone to Michael Jordan. It's just not fair. He was remarkable. ...

 

"(Kobe) doesn't shoot the same percentage (.455) as Michael (.497). He has the same characteristics as Michael, but he's not the same player. It takes nothing away from him — he's a great player in his own right."

 

http://aol.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2011-03-14/phil-jackson-says-kobe-bryant-not-in-michael-jordans-company#ixzz1Gjau8FZu

Phil has been on Kobe's ass about his shooting percentage ever since he started coaching him. According to Phil (because it's all he ever talks about), that's what separates Kobe and MJ.

 

I've stated over and over and over again why percentages are lower since the late 90's. It's a fact that 35-40 guards in Jordan's era shot 50% or better in a season (15+ PPG minimum), while it's rare to see it happen now. It's much, much easier to get to the rim when teams can't play zone defense (yeah, break out your zone defense video on MJ, the few times teams got away with it).

 

It's funny, though. One Phil quote was how Kobe didn't shoot as well as MJ, but everyone knows that Jordan's high FG% came from him getting to the rim, especially when he was younger. You stick Shaq down low, and Jordan's FG% drops. It's common basketball knowledge. Jordan would be forced to shoot the ball a bit more. Also, Bryant attempting twice as many threes has a lot to do with it as well.

 

For a player that shot twice as many threes, and played the first eight years of his career with a 356-pound center taking up the paint, one that has had to play against zone defenses and specialty defensive players, he has a pretty damn good percentage.

[reno]

Phil has been on Kobe's ass about his shooting percentage ever since he started coaching him. According to Phil (because it's all he ever talks about), that's what separates Kobe and MJ.

 

I've stated over and over and over again why percentages are lower since the late 90's. It's a fact that 35-40 guards in Jordan's era shot 50% or better in a season (15+ PPG minimum), while it's rare to see it happen now. It's much, much easier to get to the rim when teams can't play zone defense (yeah, break out your zone defense video on MJ, the few times teams got away with it).

 

It's funny, though. One Phil quote was how Kobe didn't shoot as well as MJ, but everyone knows that Jordan's high FG% came from him getting to the rim, especially when he was younger. You stick Shaq down low, and Jordan's FG% drops. It's common basketball knowledge. Jordan would be forced to shoot the ball a bit more. Also, Bryant attempting twice as many threes has a lot to do with it as well.

 

For a player that shot twice as many threes, and played the first eight years of his career with a 356-pound center taking up the paint, one that has had to play against zone defenses and specialty defensive players, he has a pretty damn good percentage.

I already went over on efg% in the previous thread, why players have a lower fg% now, and how both eras defensively is the same in terms of difficulty to score. Not gonna argue about it again.

 

MJ never had a Human Shield, a Big O line in football blocking for him when he was going at the rim.

 

Also, if shaq was clogging the paint, kb should have had more turnovers. How come kobes turnovers went up when shaq left?

Why is kobes blocks per game lower after shaq left? His assist is also higher since shaq left? Shouldn't more of his passes been feeding the grizzly monster shaq?

[Real Deal]

I already went over on efg% in the previous thread, why players have a lower fg% now, and how both eras defensively is the same in terms of difficulty to score. Not gonna argue about it again.

You didn't prove anything, just you reading what other people have written over time. You aren't even old enough to watch that era of basketball.

 

MJ never had a Human Shield, a Big O line in football blocking for him when he was going at the rim.

What? That's not how it works. This isn't the Chicago Bears.

 

Also, if shaq was clogging the paint, kb should have had more turnovers. How come kobes turnovers went up when shaq left?

That doesn't make sense. The more a player drives into the defense, the more turnovers they have (given there's less talent around them). Bryant also had the ball much more when Shaq left. That should be obvious, but I'm assuming you never watched the Lakers...ever.

 

Shaq could catch anything. He and Bryant didn't turn the ball over much when they were feeding each other buckets. That's a much different story when you're trying to post Kwame up, in an offense where you are forced to get him involved.

 

A bit tougher to pass out of doubles, also. Without Shaq, teams doubled and tripled Bryant over and over again, from 25 feet out, before and after touching the ball. What happens when you are trapped and trying to make a pass to teammates that have no idea how to move (like Smush and Walton)? You turn the ball over.

 

Why is kobes blocks per game lower after shaq left?

Because there was no big in the paint. Bryant's blocks were coming from him helping, not face up. It's well-known that a guard will block more shots when there are bigs down low, because they can come over from the weak side (like Jordan did against Starks and Ewing) and swat shots.

 

His assist is also higher since shaq left? Shouldn't more of his passes been feeding the grizzly monster shaq?

The ball was in his hands more. Kobe and Shaq were a duo. Kobe worked the perimeter, Shaq worked the post. Do you not get that? Shaq fed shooters, Kobe fed Shaq, and Kobe and Shaq got theirs.

 

Why do you bring those stats in the discussion...without actually understanding them?

[Macasero]

"MJ never had a Shaquille O'neal on his team"

 

Kobe never had a Scottie Pippen on his team either. During his younger days, his main task is to defend the other team's markee wing player. He spends half if not more than his half of his energy running through screens and defending the other team's best scorer(wing man). Having Shaq is great, but don't you guys discount having one of the best perimeter defenders in the NBA that can give you an instant 20-7-6-3-1 a night is also great.

 

And please don't tell me Shaq carried Kobe's ass in their Laker 3peat for Kobe did his part pretty damn well. Game 2 he locked down Reggie Miller in the 2k finals, game 4 he came in injured, took over the game in the last remaining minutes when Shaq fouled out. 2001 he was almost as dominating as Shaq was, same thing with 2002. Without Kobe, Shaq won't be having those 3 rings that he has. (let's not talk about the 04 finals tho )

 

It's just sad how people disregard how great Kobe is. Offensively, Kobe is slightly better than MJ.. but the rest is all MJ.

 

 

Jordan is and will always be GOAT because he had everything for him. He has the accolades, the rings, and more significantly, he's the face of basketball. There's no denying that. The timing of Jordan's emergence couldn't have been more perfect when Magic and Bird were declining, the only logical thing to do is make Jordan the face of the NBA. NBA needed another marketing subject outside Bird and Magic.. thenJordan(he earned it) came in. Yes he was famous when Magic and Bird were on their prime but when they started to decline.. That's all the push Jordan needed to become the face of NBA. Lack of a better wing players outside his teammate Pippen, Drexler, Wilkins, Kevin Johnson(to name a few) also helped his case.

[Real Deal]

The funny part is, many were calling Jordan a loser and a stat-padder before he was winning rings, saying that Magic and Bird elevated their teams to championships early in their careers, and Jordan couldn't get it done because he was selfish.

 

Then, with the teammates, he wins six.

 

Now, people are falling back on what he did before the rings, talking about the 37 PPG and how he could average 40, score 100 in a game, etc.

 

If Kobe never had a Shaq, and had the green light to step on the gas and go all out, he would've had a career average of 30+ PPG as well, a few 70-point games (EASILY, as we all saw Phil pull him from three different games where he could've done it), the 81-point game, and many other record-breaking performances.

 

Had that happened, and I brought up what he did, I'd be hearing, "Yeah, but he didn't win a ring, so he's in the same boat as Barkley."

 

It's the same story, over and over again. Nothing matters. People were trashing him for his 81-point game, and the "Kobe 62, Mavs 61" performance...among many others. It's ridiculous.

 

It's a damn shame Jordan didn't get a taste of prime Kobe.

[Oliver P]

Personally I do not understand why people are so obsessed with this Jordan-Kobe debate when talking about the greatest of All Time... I mean why are players like Bird, Magic, Jabbar, Wilt, Russell or Shaq disregarded just like that ? It's true that a case can obviously be made for both Jordan and Kobe for greatest of All Time, they both had a terrific career but so do the players I mentioned. Yes what do Jordan and Kobe have that Bird, Magic, Russell, Wilt, Jabbar and Shaq don't ? They all had terrific career, they couldn't have dreamed of better careers and that's the only thing that matters.

 

The fact is that no one can assert that one player in particular is the best of All Time for sure. There are just too many things to consider. Besides basketball is first of all a collective game, teams win rings not players, and people tend to forget about that too easily. In collective games it's easy to say that a team is the best, it's the team that wins, and it's obviously a lot harder to say who's the best player... Besides if we can tell for sure what's the best team for each season (as again it's the team that won the ring) it's a lot harder to say that a team was the best of All Time. As a matter of fact as the 1972 Lakers never played against the 1996 Bulls for example we cannot for sure who's the best of the two. Same for the 1986 Celtics and the 2001 Lakers. We can only speculate about that but we cannot tell for sure. That's a fact. So as we cannot assert that one team was the best of All Time how could we say that one player was the best of All Time ? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. We can name a few teams and say that those teams are among the best, just like we can give a few names of players who had the biggest impact on their teams and tended to dominate other players but we just cannot say that one particular team or one particular player is the best for sure.

 

Most people talk about Jordan or Kobe because most people have not seen and do not know much about other eras. But I know some people who do not think that Jordan is the best player of All Time personally. I know another poster from another forum for example who think that the best player ever is Russell. And he actually makes a very good case for him. I have no problem with his opinion, even if I personally think that Jordan is. Although the difference between me and other people is that I am not asserting it, I will never say that he is for sure. When asked who the greatest player of All Time is I always say that it is one of the seven players I mentioned, so Jordan, Wilt, Russell, Bird, Magic, Jabbar and Shaq. Why ? Because they're the players who impress me the most. And among that list Jordan is the player that impressed me the most. Just as simple as that. But I cannot assert it, once again, cause a lot of great players had fantastic careers, and they just couldn't have dreamed of a better career. Players like Kobe, Erving, Olajuwon or O for example are definitely in the discussion even if I personally were not as impressed by them as I was by the others.

 

Besides another reason why I rather mention those players is because I prefered basketball before. Honestly I'm not saying that the 2000's suck but for me (again it's just my opinion), the 90's were better. I mean for example we all know that there could be a lock out next year. Well during the last lock out I was just devastated... Waiting five months to watch basketball was already long enough, this time I had to wait till February, 4 more months ! That season was just horrible to me... Well this time, I wouldn't like it as well for sure but it wouldn't be that big of a deal. Honestly. I mean I still love basketball, it's still, and BY FAR, my favorite sport, and I enjoy watching every game I can but... honestly just not as much as I used to, not as much as in the 90's. the games were just overall better IMO. For example I rewatched the 90's Knicks-Bulls series lately and it brought back so many memories to me... Nostalgia... The games were so intense. They're still intense today, but honestly not as intense as it used to be. That's clearly the way I feel it at least. I like a lot of today's players but I would trade 'em all for all the 90's players without a doubt. So when asked who's the best player of All Time it's normal that I think first of the player who dominated my favorite era, the 90's. Or the players who dominated the Golden Era of basketball, the 80's. And the players who actually made the game of basketball... But again I would never say it for sure.

Edited March 16, 2011 by Oliver P

[Real Deal]

That sounds more like it's based on your personal preference, though. You aren't as excited about basketball. You just watched the old Knicks/Bulls series. Your favorite decade was the 90s. It all makes sense because the Knicks were one of the dominant teams of the 90s...so I'm not really sure what to say. New York basketball was irrelevant for quite some time after Ewing retired.

 

The only decades I don't consider when trying to figure out the greatest would probably be anything before the mid-70s, due to the lack of teams and players in the NBA, lack of size and athleticism.

 

Of course, we'll never know the true GOAT because these guys can't play each other. We'll never see a prime Jordan defending a prime Kobe, or Shaq and Jabbar going at it. However, looking at it that way, there's really no point to ever debate anything, because stats never tell the whole story (too many other factors surrounding them) and most everything else is based solely on opinion.

 

All I'm saying is that I've seen Jordan and Kobe play, more than any other basketball players since I started watching the game, and Kobe looks to have a more complete offensive game...the footwork is better, the jumper is better despite the tight contests, he's a more accurate passer (and more flashy), and given the circumstances (being with Shaq the first eight years, and Phil most of his career), I think Kobe's scoring and FG% could be much higher than it is already.

 

None of that opinion is based on what anyone else says. I don't listen to Mark Jackson talking about how Kobe is the GOAT. I don't listen to Scottie trying to say Jordan can average 40 today. All of that means little to me because the opinion is formed with my own eyes, and what I've seen over time.

 

Can I include Magic in this discussion? I'm sure I could argue for him, but it's well-known that he's not the defender Kobe and Jordan are, and he's also not the scorer. It's about taking the most complete players, and I don't think there are any others in that realm over the last three decades.