Griffin Dominates Thabeet

[AtTheDriveIn]

Fun, personal attacks.

 

Okay, look, if I was constructing a team, I'm taking Camby over Perkins. Let me repeat, if a joint-GM position was available, and offered to me, myself and I (did you get that? It means ME!, not you), all three of us would take Camby, because, even though apparently his level of one-on-one defense (because the NBA post players nowadays play that soooo much), according to you, is comparable to, let pulls a name out of the bag, Zach Randolph, whom I believe to be one of the poorer defenders, I still believe, and from what I've seen and watched that he's a better defender than you like making him out to be. I admit, I've gotten carried away on some things I have personally said, but some of the things you say are ridiculous; lets take a look:

 

- Camby is one of the worst defenders in the league

- He lets in 8/10 shots, even though his opponents percentage is exactly the same as Perkins

- Camby leaving made the Nuggets better defensively

 

I'm sure you wouldn't be saying it if he were still playing for the Nuggets, and doing his usual, consistent, stellar defensive job. Did I just imply you being a homer? Yes, yes I did.

 

 

 

By the way, you're purposely procrasinating at looking at www.82games.com because you know I'm right on all my data. Click the link, click the team and then click the player; it's not hard, a toddler could sift through some of this information, but apparently, there's just not enough mental capacity in that overblown forehead of yours to process something as complicated as 'opponents per48 stats' OMGHZ!!1!!q!!!.

 

 

If you're going to quote me again, please, read through and reply thoughtfully. Don't put words in my mouth. It's simple. Just reply to what I've said.

Edited July 20, 2009 by AtTheDriveIn

[Multi-Billionaire]

You're the one making the argument why should I look the stats to support your argument? Provide the stats to support your own argument. No stats, no proof, or maybe you're just making it up. If there's no link, print screen it whatever...

 

Believe it or not, Camby might be in the Zach Randolph zone defensively. He's that bad. Like I said, his stats are deceiving. You saying Camby is an elite post defender is a proof his stats have deceived you. Of course the most obvious one that sticks out is his block per game, because that's what he does best. Otherwise, tell me what else would make you say "Camby is an elite post defender" lol... because you watched highlights of "Camby playing post defense"? Puhhhlease. Maybe you, who told me to watch more games and say I know no better than other teams' fans about Nugget players, are the one who should do more game/ player watching than me.

 

 

But while his 2.0 bpg seems valuable think when a big man is not constantly patrolling the paint area. Instead of being inside the paint Camby is outside ready to swoop in for a block. Defensive three secs violation is stupid, because as a post defender you have to be aware that your presence in the paint means a lot, you can easily check out of the paint and check back in to avoid this... or by "guarding" a nearby opponent and you will never be called a defensive 3 sec violation. But Camby constantly leaves the the paint area empty. And if you're a scorer and you see a paint is empty what do you think first? Dunk right? Okay maybe layup for you, but you will go inside and not shoot. That's if you have a scorer mentality. And that's what happens with teams who use Camby's "services" ugh. So if Camby adds 2.0 bpg to the table, he also is the culprit for say 5-8 more surrendered layups/ dunks. Just because he was not in the paint, or he swoops in late and never makes the saving block. For every opponent basket he denies, he lets 3-4 easy baskets that even encourage the offense aggression of the other team and result in possibly even more baskets.

 

This same theory also applies to AI. Just because he scores 20 ppg, it's supposed to be good right? Not really. If Ray Allen averages 18 ppg, drops 30 on him... that's surrendering 12 more points. So if AI scores 20 and his man scores 12 more points than his average, that's 20 - 12 = 8. So his real value on that night is only 8, and still have not accounted the turnovers, field goal percentage, etc, etc. And sadly with AI, he has a lot of nights where he surrenders more points than his opponents usually average. Mostly because of his defensive style. He has an awful lot of games where his efficiency value is minus. That's not an asset, that's a liability.

 

 

I have to correct myself, that it's not coincidence our defense took a quantum leap by Camby and AI's departure. So not just Camby. Those extras baskets let by Camby, the gamble defense by AI and there you go... you have a perfect team defense that relies on everyone else on the team to save them... relying on Nene to clog the paint, or KMart to rotate for another failed defensive assignment... with those two gone, we no longer had players who gamble or risk on defense. We could finally become a true defensive team.

 

Again you don't know me but act like you do. I criticized Camby a lot during his tenure in Denver, even people think I hate my own team's players more than I hate other teams' players. I wanted Nuggets to trade him, although not exactly for a second round lol I praised AI when he came but he quickly ticked people off because of his non-commitment on defense, street ball style all year, and first round exits, I wanted him gone.

 

 

EDIT: also note, this is why playing positional defense, clogging the paint with hands up in the air, is often more meaningful than playing matador party block defense... Everywhere Shaq goes, there's concern that he would clog up the paint and make it tough for his own star teammate to penetrate. This is true because Shaq is usually in the paint area, and this has a reverse unintentional effect that he blocks the path to the rim and makes it tough for his own teammate. I hope this helps make sense why Perkins/ any other center "clogging" the paint, playing positional defense is a lot more valuable than someone who gambles from weakside and constantly have to leave the paint empty in order to do this.

Edited July 20, 2009 by Snake

[His Greatness]

Hopefully Griffin doesn't end up in this Sig

 

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e8/aj245/lacshameful.jpg

HEY... Brand was good and actually lifted that team out of the [expletive]ter for a good season or two.

 

EDIT: Frankie, here's the link: http://www.82games.com/0809/08LAC16.HTM. Scroll down.

 

Those metrics are very arbitrary, so take them with a grain of salt. It will always be difficult to quantify defense no matter how advanced the statistics get. They're interesting bits of info, but it's not very definitive.

Edited July 20, 2009 by His Greatness

[magicbalala245]

HEY... Brand was good and actually lifted that team out of the [expletive]ter for a good season or two

 

I didn't make it I just found it on a Laker Forum