Built Ford Tough

Kind of off topic, but have the three of us ever completely agreed on the same thing before? I guess I don't like Lou Williams as much as the rest of the people in this thread and think that there really isn't much of a difference between him and Jack, which is why I am not completely stoked on this trade. If the Raptors were to trade Jack, who I think has pretty good value around the league based on his play and the contract he is on, I would want to see the Raptors get an improvement somewhere. I guess considering the entire deal that actually does occur here as Young would be a nice upgrade at the 3 and allow Weems to come off of the bench, which is a role that he should get accustomed to. Anyways, if the deal was Belinelli + 13 for Young, I would be jumping for joy right now, but that is probably too good to be true. I guess I'm basically neutral on this trade. Won't be upset if it happens but I won't be upset if it doesn't happen either. I do have to admit that the Raptors would be a pretty fun team to watch next season if this trade were to happen. Thad, DeRozan, Weems, Williams, Bargnani (I think he is pretty fun to watch when he is on), and possibily Amir Johnson and Andrew Bynum, would definitely be an exciting young team to watch. Much better than the soft jump shooters that we have been stuck with watching since Colangelo took over. EDIT: One thing that I forgot to mention about this trade that makes me a bit hesitant is that Young's contract is up after the season. He will be restricted so the Raptors can match anything offered to him, but it would suck if somebody overpaid for him and he winded up leaving after only one year or if the Raptors overpaid to keep him.

What are Member Teams? I'm guessing something on the pre-hack OTR that I never knew about.

I found this on Real GM. It was posted by a Sixers fan who is supposedly very reliable. According to the Real GM Raptors and Sixers boards, he is the best Insider on Real GM and has called a lot of moves that the Sixers have made before they made them. Anyways, this is what he posted: Louis Williams and Thaddeous Young for Jarrett Jack, Marco Belinelli and 13th pick? Not terrible, I guess, as Williams is only 24 an Thad is only 22, and he is somewhat stuck out of position in Philly, but I don't really know how thrilled I would be with moving Jack, Belinelli and the 13th for these two. Thad is probably going to be better than anybody the Raptors could get at 13, or at the very least, equal to what we could get at 13, and he is still young, so I don't have a problem with that portion of the deal. However, I don't really know about Jack for Williams. Thoughts on this potential rumor? I'm not sure what to think to be honest. I probably wouldn't do the trade but I don't think I would be furious, like I have been on quite a few Colangelo moves, if the trade went down.

This is all from that same ESPN Insider article I found the stuff about the Raptors targeting a top 3 pick in. I just figured I would post this in this thread as it isn't relevant enough for its own thread like the stuff I mentioned in the other thread. Questions about Daniel Orton's knee? There is also talk about the Jazz leaning towards drafting Greg Monroe (if he is there) and if he isn't, they apperantly will pick between Xavier Henry, Gordan Hayward or Luke Babbitt with Babbitt apperantly having an edge. He also mentions that if the Pacers draft a point guard at 10, it is looking like it will be Avery Bradley over Eric Bledsoe.

I know Chad Ford isn't exactly the most reliable person but he posted that the Raptors are looking to try and move up into the top 3 and have discussed with the Sixers and Nets about the availability of their respective picks. He also says that they would consider moving out of the draft if the right deal came along. This is from an Insider article: He also says that the Pacers, Spurs and Thunder are the most aggressive when it comes to trying to move up in the draft and that the Sixers want somebody to take Brand with the 2nd pick (which we already know), but he says that some GM's think they will soften their demands as the draft gets nearer. He speculates about them putting Iguodala on the market as well. Anyways, in regards to the Raptors portion of this, I would absolutely love it if they managed to get into the top 3 and come away with one of Turner, Favours or Cousins. I know that Brand's contract is an absolute albatross, but I would definitely consider acquiring him if it meant that the Raptors could get a legitimate building block like Evan Turner. MLSE has deep pockets and may be willing to take on the financial hit though. One thing that worries me about the mention of them moving out of the draft if the deal is right. I can't help but notice the timing of this report combined with the speculation around Mo Williams coming to Toronto. I would be all for the move if the Raptors traded Calderon and a 2nd or something but no way in hell would I move the 13th along with Calderon for Williams. I don't expect anything to happen, at least when it comes to moving up in the draft, but it is good to hear at least speculation about them wanting to move up, regardless of the fact that there is a 99% chance it won't happen.

Why? Williams is on a cheaper contract and it saves the Raptors some money. He could probably be flipped for another player at some point over the next 3 years easier than Calderon could as well. Its not like Williams would be good enough to [expletive] up the Raptors draft position next year either. There is always the possibility that he wants out of Toronto so bad that he doesn't pick up his player option for the 3rd year too, haha.

Yeah, actually it was. I didn't realize I typed a half as I was paying attention to the game not what I was typing. Shelden Williams single handedly trying to let the Lakers back into the game. What terrible decision making from him.

Kobe Bryant and Donyell Marshall have both hit 12 in a game. Ray Allen, Michael Redd and others have hit 8 in a half. Not sure about a Finals game. EDIT: They just showed that Allen tied a record for most 3's in a half in a Finals game.

When Ray Allen's shot is on, he is so much fun to watch.

Nothing serious, just some comment on Holly MacKenzie's Twitter that I noticed, and I don't even think much of it, but I thought I would post it anyways. If the trade was Calderon for Williams, I would do it without even thinking about it. It is debatable who the better player is (Williams is the better scorer while Calderon is the better point guard and both suck on defense) but Williams has the more favourable contract between the two. Mo Williams 20010/11: $9,300,000 2011/12: $8,500,000 2012/13: $8,500,000 (player option) Jose Calderon 2010/11: $9,000,000 @011/12: $9,780,993 2012/13: $10,561,985 The Raptors would save around $3M by making this trade, whcih isn't a lot, but considering they won't be sacrificing talent, it would have to be considered a smart move. However, the question is, would this trade just be Calderon for Williams straight up, or would other factors be invovled? Like I said above, this is purely speculation and I wouldn't even call it a rumor yet, but I figured I would post it anyways. EDIT: Here is a non-Twitter link to more speculation about this. It basically says the exact same thing. http://www.news-herald.com/articles/2010/06/06/sports/nh2600140.txt

It makes sense to look at it that way, but as far as I am concerned, the Raptors should go with whoever they think is the best player available. I could understand looking to fill that need if the Raptors were a playoff caliber team next season, but considering they are looking to be one of the worst teams in the NBA next year, I would rather see them draft a player who they think will be the best for them long term than miss out on somebody because they don't fill a short term need. Drafting a big makes sense though and if the big is the BPA, even better. However, I wouldn't pass on somebody like Paul George or Xavier Henry (first two non-bigs that I thought of) if they drop to 13 so that I could draft somebody like Daniel Orton.

Call me crazy, but if any of the three (James, Bosh, Wade) were to take a paycut, I actually think James would be the most likely of the three. I don't think that any of them would, but with all of James endorsement deals and how lucrative all of those are, I could see him being the most likely of the three to take a paycut if it means he joins a team that he has a legitimate shot at winning a championship. It wouldn't surprise me if James signed a shorter, 3 year deal or something for less money to join a team in an attempt to win a championship or two and then after that contract is up he goes and signs a lucrative, long term deal. Didn't he say something about not being particularly concerned about money on that Larry King Interivew the other night, as well? Not saying that is a huge factor or anything, just mentioning it. I would be absolutely shocked if Bosh took a paycut because he is less marketable than the other two and doesn't have the same type of income from other areas than the other two do. There is also the fact that Bosh has basically laughed at the idea of taking a paycut on more than one occasion. He could've changed his mind after talking with other players though, but from everything that I have heard, it sounds very unlikely that he takes a paycut. There is also the issue with the CBA that has to be taken into account. I don't know how willing somebody like Bosh would be to take a paycut with all of the uncertainty surrounding the CBA. I think Bosh is aware that this is his only chance to get a max contract considering his status in the league and the fact that there are questions about his knees already, which will probably only grow as time passes. Bottom line is that I think it is highly unlikely that any of these three leave an extra $30M on the table, especially a lesser star like Bosh. James and Wade, maybe, but I don't see Bosh doing it.

I wouldn't really call him a steal. It is sounding more and more likely that he is going to be taken in the top 10. He has absolutely skyrocketed up the rankings since the end of the season. If he were to have stayed where originally thought, which was the 16-24 range, then yeah I could definitely see him being a steal, but considering he could easily go top 10, or maybe even higher, I don't see him as a steal. I was high on him ever since first reading about him, but I didn't think he would impress as much as he has during workouts and certainly didn't think he could wind up being a top 10 pick.

Xavier Henry will be working out for Toronto sometime this month: http://projectspurs.com/2010-articles/may/spurs-leaning-towards-henry.html That is about all I really found in regards to the Raptors and the draft. It seems like it was a pretty slow day in regards to all things Raptors.

It is obvious why he is doing this. The Raptors and Knicks have agreed on a Bosh for Lee trade and Colangelo informed Lee that he has to work on his 3 point shot. I can imagine it now. DeRozan and Jack will be posting up while Bargnani and Lee stand outside waiting for the kickout. Seriously though, as long as he doesn't rely on a perimeter jumper and still mixes it up down low, I have no problems with this. However, if he starts to drift further and further away from the basket and becomes a jump shooting big, I would hate to have him on my team as it would take away on of the best parts of Lee's game, which is the hustle plays and offensive rebounding.

And the sky is blue, what is your point? Nobody has tried to say otherwise. Yes, Keyon Dooling made $3.8M this season. However, he has a team option for next year which means that the Heat would simply not pick up his option and, as a result, the Heat would save the nearly $5M ($4.962 to be exact) that would be owed to Beasley next season. If you are going to take a know it all approach to something, the least you could do is, you know, actually know what you are talking about. No arguments here, at least if we are talking about offensively. Defensively is another story as Beasley doesn't really have the versatility to guard on the low block or on the wing. Correct me if I am wrong, but don't the Nets have the cap room to add two max free agents this summer? If that is the case, adding Beasley would take away that luxury so it could possibily come down to Beasley + Joe Johnson or Chris Bosh/Amare Stoudemire (or any other marquee free agent, those were just the first two teams that came to mind) + Joe Johnson. If that is the case, it is pretty clear what scenario is more appealing. I'm sure that Beasley has his fair share of interest around the league considering his age and the possibility of how good he can become, but to say that almost every team int he league would be interested in Beasley is just false. I could definitely see some teams that are not interested in Beasley, and I know of one for a fact one team that aren't interested in him which is the Toronto Raptors. Basically, what I am trying to say is that don't you think you might be overvaluing Beasley a bit here? Actually, unless I am mistaken, the summary is actually that the Heat lose out on the chance of adding a 2nd max free agent to gain a power forward who may become an All-Star but could also end up as nothing more than an offensive 6th man (a damn good one though). You would imagine, but with so many teams gearing up for free agency this summer, there may not be a lot of teams that are going to be interested in taking on Beasley for nearly $5M this year, $6.2M next year and $8.1M the year after. Then there are obviously some concerns about his attitude and maturity (whether they are valid or not) which could scare some teams off as well and result in the Heat not receiving what you would expect. The bottom line is that rarely do you see a trade where equal talent is exchanged. I can't really comment on this. I would believe so, but crazier things have happened. Also, its not like Riley or somebody is going to come out and say that they don't want Beasley on the team or anything. Doing something like that lowers his value and ruins the relationship between the player and the team. With all of this said, I also find it hard to believe that the trade was simply Beasley for Dooling straight up. However, if the Heat were interested in unloading Beasley's contract to clear up more cap space, it makes perfect sense considering they could simply no pick up Dooling's option for next season. EDIT: Ira Winderman reports that the Heat never offered Beasle to the Nets. He also says that the Nets weren't interested in Beasley anyways. I don't know him or anything, but from what you have said in the past, Ira isn't very credible, right? http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67010/20100604/heat_never_offered_beasley_to_nets/#

Raptors enamoured with Cole Aldrich: Daniel Orton unimpressive: Info on next week: All from Doug Smith's blog. I'm glad to hear that they aren't too impressed with Orton. I liked him at the beginning of the whole draft process, but I have soured on him with each new report that is released. He didn't measure out as big as I thought he was, he looks extremely raw and now there are questions/concerns about his conditioning, which could be because of him missing his entire senior season and playing limited minutes last season or it could be a sign of laziness on his part. Factor all of this in with my original concern in regards to his knees, and I am starting to want no part of Orton at 13. He may be worth the risk if he falls and the Raptors pick up an extra pick, but that is all. As far as them being high on Aldrich and Udoh, I like both of these guys so no complaints there. Aldrich would be a great fit beside Bargnani (and if Calderon and Turkoglu both stay the Raptors could have a 4 white guys starting ) and while he doesn't have the upside of a Whiteside or somebody, I don't see him ever not being, at the very least, a serviceable big off of the bench. Udoh may not have the size that Aldrich does, but there is something about him that I really like. Maybe it is the cool name.

From Doug Smith's blog: I don't expect Wright to be back next season, that is for sure, but if Colangelo is able to get something in return for Wright, I would be pleasently surprised. I don't really see the point in another team agreeing to a sign and trade for Wright, and I imagine the return if such a scenario were to happen would be nothing more than a 2nd round pick or something, but if it happens I would definitely be surprised and pleased considering in my mind, it is basically a 100% certainty that Wright won't be back next year.

Updates from the workouts today. Holly MacKenzie's Twitter: Doug Smith said that Orton had conditioning issues There are interviews up on the Raptors website, like usual. Raptors won't be having workouts next week as Gherardini, Ujiri and Hughes will be heading to Treviso to watch the Euro Camp. I think workouts will begin back up around mid month, or a week before the draft. Also, something else interesting in regards to the Pacers draft situation. This comment from a Pacer's beat writer was posted on MacKenzie's Twitter last night sometime: It looks like Bradley had the better workout than Bledsoe yesterday for the Pacers. It doesn't seem like the two of them will work out against one another for the Raptors so this might be the best we get from them. Lastly, I posted this in the Draft Forum, but it looks like Donatas Motiejunas and possibly Kevin Seraphin will be withdrawing from the draft. Not that I wanted the Raptors to take Motiejunas or anything (I wouldn't have minded Seraphin with a late 1st though) but this sucks to hear simply because it weakens the depth of the draft. Without a potential lottery pick in Motiejunas, guys will all get bumped up a spot and if teams are looking to pick up a big late in the first, their options are going to be more limited considering having two first round bigs pull out of the draft will mean that guys like Alabi and Sanders may move up from late first round to mid first round. Hopefully this doesn't ruin any plans of buying a late pick to get a guard/big (depending on who they select at 13).

http://www.nba.com/2010/news/06/03/aldridge.draft.update/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt2 Also, Kevin Seraphin, a French big man who was moving up the draft boards and was predicted to go around 20-27 in the first round, may be withdrawing from the draft as well. Two projected first round bigs are looking like they may withdraw, which sucks for teams who were hoping to purchase a late first rounder to try and make full use out of what is considered to be a fairly deep draft (although not much star power). Good news for some players like Soloman Alabi or Larry Sanders though. The chances of them slipping down the draft board drastically decreased if both of these two pull out of the draft.

According to Holly McKenzie's Twitter, tomorrows workout will consist of Daniel Orton, Larry Sanders, Ekpe Udoh, Jeremey Wise, Eric Hayes and Cole Aldrich. I'm really liking the group coming to workout for the Raptors tomorrow, especially after yesterdays consisted of fringe first rounders at best. I'm really liking the fact that the Raptors are bringing in 4 first round talent big men to work out against each other. It should be interesting reading about how Orton, Aldrich, Udoh and Sanders do against one another. Also, if anybody is interested in seeing video of a workout that included Orton, Whiteside, Udoh and Lance Stephenson, there is one posted on the Indiana Pacers website. It is only 2 minutes long or so, but considering you rarely get to see any footage of private workouts, it is worth taking a look. From what I saw, Whiteside showed his length and shot blocking ability. He had a couple of nice blocks and he hit a nice jumper from the top of the circly over Udoh. He looked pretty raw when going down to the low block and he does seem to have the usual shot blocker tendancy of drifting towards the basket on defense, leaving his man in the process. He was probably the most impressive from what I saw of the short clip. Udoh looked small compared to Whiteside. He showed nice athletcisim and finished around the rim fairly well, but Whiteside`s length seemed to bother him a bit. He missed some easy shots around the basket and seemed a bit nervous. I think that he will be a power forward in the NBA and not a center, but he is definitely talented. As for Orton, one word can sum up what I saw from him; RAW. He looked confused on defense and I didn`t really notice him much on offense, other than a jumper that he hit at the beginning of the clip. I knew that Orton was raw, but if this video is any indication, he is more raw than I thought. It is hard to comment on a 2 minute video though, but after him measuring smaller than I had thought and now him looking very raw in this video, I don`t know what to think of him. Last thing is that the Pacers are working out Bradley, Bledose, Jordan Crawford, Willie Warron and Sherron Collins today, so I'm guessing there will be video of that workout up tomorrow on their website, which should be interesting to watch. I've wanted Bradley and Bledsoe to work out with one another for a while now, so it should be good to see how the two do against one another. Well, there is my usual daily post in this thread, haha.

He probably could've played pro soccer if he had focused on it instead of basketball. He plays regularly in the summer (he has trained with New York's MLS team). He was a major factor in Vancouver getting an MLS team in 2011 and has been a part owner of the Whitecaps since 2008. He is also an investor in Women's Professional Soccer. Nash has been a lifelong soccer fan and has actually done a lot of things in his life for soccer.

A couple of things. First, todays workouts include: Ben Uzoh (Guard 6ft 3) Tusla Michael Roll (Guard 6ft 5) UCLA Latavious Williams (Forward 6ft 8) Tusla (NBDL) Devin Ebanks (Forward 6ft 7) West Virginia Samardo Samuels (Forward 6ft 9) Louisville Gani Lawal (Forward 6ft 8) Georgia Tech Ebanks is the only player that I really have any interest in, and that is assuming that the Raptors buy a later pick and use it on him if they really like him. None of these guys are going to be the pick at 13 in my mind, and it definitely looks like they are working out some fringe 1st rounders to see if they like anybody. Secondly, there aren't going to be any workouts tomorrow according to Matt Devlin. Thirdly, here is a bit more on the Bradley workout: http://blogs.thescore.com/nba/2010/05/31/a-little-love-for-toronto/ It is interesting that they say this because we all know that the Raptors were in love with DeRozan last season. They went to watch him in private workouts and immediately had him come to Toronto during their first group workout of the year, much like they did with Bradley. Also, out of curiousity, does anybodys opinion on Avery Bradley change now that it seems like Turkoglu isn't going to be back with the Raptors next season? I still love his game and want him here regardless of Turkoglu or not, but I know that some people thought it was such a great fit because having Turkoglu on the roster would make him be able to play off of the ball and not forced to run the offense. Without Turkoglu, that luxury is gone. Lastly, here are some comments about Hayward's workout yesterday from Jim Kelly. http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/66936/20100601/hayward_works_out_for_toronto/#ixzz0pdALZs59 EDIT: Here is some more stuff that I just came across. http://blogs.thescore.com/nba/2010/06/01/were-talking-predraft-workouts-session-2/ There are also interviews and things like that in the link I just posted.

Carlesimo is a pretty solid defensive coach. During his three years in Portland they had the 7th, 5th and 7th best defensive ratings respectively and they ranked 9th, 9th and 11th in opponents points per game. In Golden State the first year he took over the team (97-98) they had a defensive rating and oppg of 18th and 20th respectively, but the next season they were 10th and 12th respectively, which is pretty impressive considering the roster he had. His time in Seattle/OKC was a disaster though. I think that reflects as much on the roster as it does him though. Like I said above, he was also the Spurs lead assitaint from 02-07 and won three NBA Championships during that span. He has always had a reputation as a firery, defensive minded coach (save for his disaster in Seattle). Will he be able to get the Raptors to play defense though? Who knows, how many coaches out there are capable of not having Jose Calderon, Andrea Bargnani and Hedo Turkoglu suck on defense? Personally, I think it is a step in the right direction, but its not like bringing him in is going to all of a sudden make the Raptors a good defensive team. Some of his defensive principles and philosophies may help, but ultimately, the Raptors roster as it is will never be a good defensive team.

The Raptors had Avery Bradley, Willie Warren, Gordan Hayward and Stanley Robinson in for workouts today. You can watch interviews with Hayward and Bradley on the Raptors website. Not much else to post about as these workouts are usually kept pretty quiet and you don't hear much until closer to the draft. Just thought I would post who the Raptors worked out today. Also, the workout that was going to take place on Wednsday might not happen according to Doug Smith. Not exactly sure why. EDIT: DX also updated their mock today. They still have the Raptors taking Orton at 13 but Greg Monroe moved up to 5th, they have Babbitt going 12th, George moved from 23rd to 15th, Bradley moving from 28th to 18th, Whiteside falling to 20th and Bledsoe going 26th. They also updated their top 100 prospects. http://www.draftexpress.com/rankings/Top-100-Prospects/