Toronto's offense and defense reaching historic proportions

[Erick Blasco]

The Raptors my wind up being the best offensives team and the worst defensive team of all time in each category.

 

It's been reported, most prominently by ESPN.com's John Hollinger (Insider only), that Toronto has posted the league's best Offensive Rating thus far, as well as its worst Defensive Rating. On its own, that's a mean feat, one accomplished just twice since the NBA-ABA merger and not in the last 25 years. (The Raptors' semi-dubious predecessors: the 1978-79 Houston Rockets and 1981-82 Denver Nuggets.) But saying the team merely has the best offense and worst defense in the league actually understates the magnitude of the kind of extremism we're seeing in Toronto. It's very early, but so far the Raptors have both the best offense and the worst defense since the merger, as measured by percentage above or below league average.

 

Team Yr ORtg LgRtg Adj

-----------------------------------------

TORONTO 09-10 117.6 107.4 9.5

Dallas 03-04 114.1 104.2 9.5

Phoenix 04-05 116.6 107.4 8.6

Dallas 01-02 114.0 105.8 7.8

Phoenix 06-07 116.1 108.1 7.4

Dallas 02-03 112.7 104.9 7.4

Sacramento 03-04 111.8 104.2 7.2 If nothing else, the Raptors have a pretty good shot at being the best offense that was not run by Steve Nash, a title currently held by the 2003-04 Sacramento Kings. Yet their defense has been even worse relative to the league.

 

Team Yr DRtg LgRtg Adj

-----------------------------------------

TORONTO 09-10 117.7 107.4 -9.6

L.A. Clippers 98-99 111.5 103.4 -7.8

Seattle 05-06 115.9 107.7 -7.6

Denver 98-99 111.2 103.4 -7.5

Orlando 03-04 112.0 104.2 -7.1

Dallas 92-93 117.2 109.4 -7.1 Needless to say, none of those other teams made the playoffs. In fact, three of the five changed coaches midseason. Only one of the five coaches made it all the way to the next year (the Clippers' Chris Ford).

 

http://www.basketbal...p?articleid=796

Edited November 26, 2009 by Erick Blasco

[Check my Stats]

I wonder if this is what BC's envision was when he started building this team. Pretty pathetic our best defender in the starting 5 is probably our rookie. You can get by with bad defenders, but Bargnani and Jose look absolutely lost on defense. Their defensive woes hurt us more than their offense helps us IMO.

[BasX]

I wouldn't say probably DeRozan is our best defender in our starting 5, i think its not even close that he is. He takes on the best wing and does well, especially for a rookie. Obviously he's had troubles, but the kid works hard. Right Doug Smith?

[Check my Stats]

Bosh is probably our best defender, his defense is vastly underrated he is a solid defender at the very least. Demar is still shaky and while he is good at contesting the shot, he often gives up the drive and there is no help because Bargnani is nowhere to be found and Bosh isn't really a shotblocker.

 

As long as Bargnani is on this team we won't achieve any success beyond mediocrity, unless he somehow learns how to play defense and stops wandering on the defensive end.

 

Gerald Wallace said about our interior defense that Bosh is the only big man at the rim, makes it easy when every time you drive that Bosh is the only one there, and he isn't really a guy that will strike fear into the slashers.

 

We can afford to give up Bargnani's streaky scoring if we could get another young big man who plays defense and rebounds very good.

 

We should have traded for Chandler when he was cheap as dirt.

Edited November 26, 2009 by travesy3

[BasX]

The only thing that gets me with Bosh is defense is mostly hustle, and on that end, he doesn't show it a lot of the time. However, like you said, how can you show hustle when Jose is playing.

[Built Ford Tough]

I was looking through RealGM and came acrosse some things on there that put into perspective just how bad the Raptors are defensively (well, to add another perspective, I guess). Take a look at these numbers:

 

Opponent Assist Rate (% of opponent possessions ending in an assist): 21.8% (27th of 30)

 

Opponent Assisted FGM Rate (% of opponent FGM that are assisted): 60.8% (28th of 30)

 

Opponent Turnover Rate (% of opponent possessions ending in an turnover): 11.1% (29th of 30)

 

Defensive Plays Rate (% of defensive plays per 100 opponent possessions): 12.7 (28th of 30)

 

Opponent Free Throw Rate (% of opponent attempts ending in free throw attempts): 37% (28th of 30)

 

Opponent 3-pt Rate (% of opponent attempts ending in 3-pt attempts): 25% (28th of 30)

 

Even the worst defensive teams in the NBA are only usual at the bottom of 2 or 3, maybe 4 if they are really bad, of these catagories, but the Raptors have somehow managed to be basically at the bottom of all 6 of these catagories. These numbers basically show that opposing teams can do whatever the hell they want against the Raptors as they are epicly terrible at stopping any sort of 3 point attempt, drives, free throws etc...

 

Here is something that maybe just as concerning as the numbers that I posted above.

 

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/7113/tovfoul1g.jpg

 

In case you aren't aware of what this graph is showing, it is the number of fouls committed per turnovers forced. Basically what this is showing is that the Raptors foul at a high rate, yet still manage to turn the opponent over very rarely. So when the Raptors do decide to play aggressive defense they aren't forcing the opponent to turn the ball over at all, and usually end up commiting a stupid or weak foul that ends up sending them to the free throw line. The Raptors aren't gambling on defense or anything like that, but they are getting burned worse than teams like Golden State who basically gamble on every possession. How pathetic is that?

 

Lets take a look at Jose Calderon for a minute as I was looking through 82games.com and found something so pathetic that it actually made me laugh.

 

Say what you want about PER, but it can be a very useful stat if you look at it correctly. Well, Calderon has a PER of 17.5, which isn't terrible at all. The league average is around 15 or so according to an article that I read a little while ago (I'll try to find a link if I remember). However, defensively opposing point guards have a PER of 23.7 against him. How bad is that? Well, lets look at some of the elite point guards PER numbers and PER against:

 

Steve Nash: 25, 14.8 against

Deron Williams: 20.8, 16.5 against

Chris Paul: 36.3, 19.5 against (hasn't played as many games so numbers are somewhat inflated)

 

So, basically, opposing point guards are as effective as a Steve Nash against the Raptors because of Calderon's incompetence defensively. Granted all of the blame can't be put strictly on Calderon's shoulders as defense is a team issue, but as the primary defender you can put a lot of the blame on him.

 

I would do this same thing for Bargnani, but as a Raptors fan, I don't know if I would be able to stomach what I may find, lol.

 

On defense the Raptors are just a complete mess though. Going beyond statistics and what not, and just speaking from a fans perspective who has only missed 1 game so far this season and bits and pieces of others, the Raptors simply are not committed to playing defense. It seems like there is little to no communication, Triano's system of "protect the house" is not working because the Raptors are getting destroyed all over the floor, the Raptors play uninspired at this end of the floor, there is no help and I could probably go on and on for another couple of paragraphs about the Raptors matadoric defense, but I will save you all the trouble of reading what I am sure you are all already aware of.

 

Bottom line is that the Raptors are on pace for being the worst defensive team in the history of the modern era, and I don't see anything from them that would suggest that it will turn around anytime soon. They let the Charlotte [expletive]ing Bobcats drop 116 or so points on them. Enough said.

 

EDIT: Here is part of that article I was talking about in regards to Calderon's PER and what not.

 

Calderon's player efficiency rating (PER) is only slightly better than that of the average NBA player's thus far. The league average of the all-encompassing stat devised by ESPN.com's John Hollinger – which, though it's not perfect, is the best measure yet devised of a player's per-minute effectiveness – is 15. Calderon was riding at about 17.3 as of Monday.

 

The problem is, when Calderon is on the floor, the opposing point guard is putting up a PER of 23.7, according to 82games.com. For an example of an NBA point guard achieving a PER in the neighbourhood of 23.7, think Steve Nash, who the Raptors will see on Sunday when the resurgent Phoenix Suns come to town.

 

In other words, Calderon is such a non-factor on defence he is making all of his opponents look like Nash.

 

In a point guard's league, Toronto is a minus-6.4 in point-guard PER when Calderon is on the floor. A year ago, even with the awful Roko Ukic and Will Solomon backing up Calderon, the Raptors, as a team, were a plus-1.1 at the position.

 

So you can blame Calderon, who has yet to prove himself as an elite NBA starter over 82 games, or you can blame Triano, even if he deserves more than 81 games to test his defensive schemes.

 

http://www.thestar.com/sports/basketball/nba/raptors/article/731529--feschuk-a-case-of-d-eacute-j-agrave-vu-for-raptors

Edited November 27, 2009 by Built Ford Tough

[GamerGuy]

That's some horrifying numbers to see. When you have a close game on your hands, and the game is nearly over, you can't solely rely on your offense to pull you through. You need to be able to get some defensive stops without fouling to help ensure a win.

 

I can't really remember the last time the Raptors were decent defensively, but I think you guys need to bring in some guys on the coaching staff that are defensive minded. Granted it falls to the players in the end on whether or not they'll be more aggressive defensively, but it is definitely a starting point.

[Built Ford Tough]

That's some horrifying numbers to see. When you have a close game on your hands, and the game is nearly over, you can't solely rely on your offense to pull you through. You need to be able to get some defensive stops without fouling to help ensure a win.

 

I can't really remember the last time the Raptors were decent defensively, but I think you guys need to bring in some guys on the coaching staff that are defensive minded. Granted it falls to the players in the end on whether or not they'll be more aggressive defensively, but it is definitely a starting point.

 

01-02 the Raptors were one of the better defensive teams in the league. When Carter went down during the final stretches of the season and the Raptors made their playoff push, they did it with their defense. For the most part though, back during the Carter era, the Raptors were more of a defensive oriented team, although they could still score. I would say that they were slightly more defensive oriented than offensively, for the most part, at least from what I remember.

 

Actually, now that I just took a quick look at the numbers to refresh my memory, they were basically slightly above average both offensively and defensively with the 00-01 season being the exception as they were one of the higher scoring teams in the league (while still being fairly solid defensively).

 

To be perfectly honest though, it wouldn't matter if you put Tom Thibodeau as an assistant, or even head coach, on this team. The way that Colangelo has built the team will always mean that they are one of the worst defensive teams in the league. There is only so much that a coach or a system can do, if you don't have the proper personnel to execute what the coaching staff wants or the system demands, it doesn't matter. It would help a little bit, but it would not make a significant difference. No matter what the systm, coaching staff or whatever is, players like Jose Calderon and Andrea Bargnani are still going to be liabilities defensively.

 

At least that is my stance on it.

[Built Ford Tough]

Man, just when I thought that the Raptors couldn't get any worse defensively, they go and have the worst defensive game that I have ever watched as a Raptors fan. I have watched some horrific defense being played by the Raptors since I started following them, but tonights display of efense (there was no "d") was by far the worst that I have ever see. The performance that they gave against the Duncan and Parker less Spurs wasn't even this bad.

 

What a joke this team is. I would be ashamed of myself if I was Bryan Colangelo. I would be embarassed if I built a team that couldn't stop somebody if they played 5-1 (and the 1 person was a parapalegic).

[Real Deal]

Hahaha...is this somewhat deserving of a topic in the same way the Nets' 0-18 record-breaking start is?

 

If so, Toronto sure didn't disappoint tonight.

 

I'm not really sure if ANYONE on the Raptors wants to play defense, and I still think Toronto is banking on Calderon making way too many plays, which explains their offensive inconsistencies.

[Built Ford Tough]

Hahaha...is this somewhat deserving of a topic in the same way the Nets' 0-18 record-breaking start is?

 

If so, Toronto sure didn't disappoint tonight.

 

I'm not really sure if ANYONE on the Raptors wants to play defense, and I still think Toronto is banking on Calderon making way too many plays, which explains their offensive inconsistencies.

 

To be perfectly honest, I would rather be a Nets fan right now than a Raptors. At least the Nets have something to look forward to with guys like Brook Lopez and Devin Harris, along with a great draft pick which could very well end up being John Wall. All the Raptors have to look forward to right now is constantly giving up 120 points a game, having Chris Bosh leave the team and have a core of Andrea Bargnani, Jose Calderon and Hedo Turkoglu heading forward, all of which are overpaid and players that you can't build around.

 

As for the Raptors offense, I think the problem is more along the lines of them being strictly jump shot oriented. Aside from Bosh nobody on the team can consistently get to the rim or the free throw line. Even then, Bosh is starting to shoot more and more jumpers as the season goes along and, from what I have seen, looks like he is about ready to give up on this team. When you rely as heavily on jump shots as the Raptors do, you are going to be a very inconsistent team because there is simply no way that your shots are going to fall every night, especially on the tail end of back to backs, which the Raptors have been destroyed on. Other problems are obviously there, like them relying too much on Calderon to make players (which is pretty pathetic considering Calderon isn't even that good of a playmaker) and Bosh being somewhat of a black hole offensively, but the biggest thing with them is that they are way too reliant on jump shots.

 

Jump shooting teams are always going to be inconsistent and the Raptors are basically the definition of a jump shooting team.

 

At least I think that this is the biggest problem with them offensively. Even then, I am not going to complain for a second about their offense because even when they have an off night, it will most likely still result in an 85-90 point night, which is enough to win a game if you actually play some defense.

[Real Deal]

Well, that's my thing about Calderon. He either shoots the ball, or he looks to pass to a jumpshooter. I don't see him driving the lane and kicking it out very much when I do watch the Raptors, and you guys need a point guard that can do that.

 

Hell, that would get your shooters wide open, at least, lol.

 

Do you guys miss TJ Ford? ^_^

[Check my Stats]

Jack should be starting for Jose or Amir should be starting for Bargnani, or both. The two of them really can't be on the floor together but either way both of these guys make 10 million dollars and are BC's Golden Boys so Triano won't do this.

 

A lot of stuff has been coming out lately about how Triano is scared to call out certain players and this is clearly Bargnani and Calderon and probably Turkoglu. For [expletive] sakes I am hardly even watching the game, but we are down like 30 and Hedo is on the sidelines laughing? JOKING? I would really love to know what is so funny because Raptors nation wants everyone in the Toronto organizations' head right now.

 

Calderon and Bargnani don't try because they don't have to, they are going to play 30 minutes regardless. I would rather see Demar and Jack and Amir get the minutes because at least these guys are playing hard regardless of the situation. These guys make an effort while Jose, Bargnani and Turk just take jumpers all day and don't get back on D.

 

This is just a frustrating team to watch, because the coaching staff isn't getting the best out of their players for one of two reasons. 1. Triano isn't allowed to give the minutes to someone other than Jose or Bargnani because of BC. Or 2. he simply doesn't have the player's respect.

 

Today we saw guys questioning the schemes and some subtle shots at Jay it seemed, at least when things weren't so good with Sam last year no one was blaming the coach (at least players).

 

We need a balance, we need hustle guys. We can't have 5 finesse players on the floor at a time, especially starting. Moving Jose or Bargs to the bench brings in a hustle player or a superiour defender/rebounder and adds a scoring punch to the bench. At least Amir is willing to crash the boards with Bosh. But like I said, Bargnani will probably never go the bench and Jose won't unless he himself suggests it.

 

It is time to trade Bargnani before other GM's realize how horrible he is. He is averaging decent numbers so at face value he might still get good value. I would trade him for a package of picks or just a rebounder. When Camby got traded for a 2nd that was a great deal for LAC, that is the kind of deal BC needs to get in on.

Edited December 3, 2009 by travesy3

[Built Ford Tough]

Well, that's my thing about Calderon. He either shoots the ball, or he looks to pass to a jumpshooter. I don't see him driving the lane and kicking it out very much when I do watch the Raptors, and you guys need a point guard that can do that.

 

Hell, that would get your shooters wide open, at least, lol.

 

Do you guys miss TJ Ford? ^_^

 

Calderon doesn't drive and kick becausee he simply doesn't have the skill set to do this. He is 100% reliant on a screen to get his offense. He isn't a creative enough ball handler nor does he really have good enough speed to break his man down off of the bounce.

 

This is why he was such a great fit on the team back when Ford was here. Ford was all about driving and kicking and was the far superior creator in one on one situations. Calderon was the better shooter and his efficient, low risk, pick and roll style was a great contrast to Ford's game.

 

As for whether or not I miss Ford, I can't really say that I miss him per say, but I would much rather have him on the team over Calderon just because his playing style is much better suited for this team than Calderon's, and Ford is on the better contract as well. Ford hasn't really played all that well in Indiana since he got traded there but his game is better suited to this Raptors team than Calderon's is and I like him more as a player.